NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

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JenKozy
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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by JenKozy » Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:51 pm

Just one question.

Are judges REQIRED to attend "training"?
I am NOT too old for this!

I'd rather be Dreaming... in a tree.

guard matey
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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by guard matey » Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:54 pm

Just one answer.

Yes.
The Golden Rule still applies. :)

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by Zero » Sun Apr 08, 2012 4:46 pm

With hopes that this post is not seen as bashing or pure criticism of the circuit, I do have a few insights and questions about the process.

What goes into the process of selection of judges and training? In the years I have watched this sport grow, I have seen many individuals become judges with programs that have yet to grow in many ideologies and educational standpoints that the NCBA has put on the table. While there are qualified judges on the panel, with experience that goes beyond the activity and even spans nationwide, like Ron Salinas, and for those who have not met him before, his views on the educational standards in the guard world are professional and his perspective in general effect are amazing, there are a good number of judges who still need growth in their own activities, especially with their own schools. So what qualifies them in that respect?

Taking the other side of the coin, there are individuals, who are and who are not instructing at present, that would be a great asset to the association that are not judging. Are those individuals being approached and invited to share their expertise? While I have seen different individuals being brought in from the outside, like Jhay Delos Reyes, who marched with the Vanguard for several years, apprenticing, there are outstanding individuals within our Northern California area that could definitely be utilized to further the education within the circuit. I'd love to see JoJo Dangerfield back and sharing her knowledge. Rena Quicho, who taught Vallejo HS a few years back, her insight on movement would bring a great depth of knowledge to those who need ideas from basic to advanced movement. Even Mitchell Hautea, who marched with James Logan and the Blue Devils and trained under Scott Chandler, TJ Doucette, and Mark Metzger, and teaches a school in the circuit, why isn't he invited to adjudicate groups? I would assume his school, Bethel, while inactive this year, has been notably successful in the past few years. I could continue to give examples of more names from different successful programs like Vanden, Fremont, Vallejo, Saratoga, etc. However, I digress.

Something I have discussed with other instructors within and out of the circuit, but should an instructor who is currently teaching a group be allowed to judge during the season? That doesn't mean they can't attend meetings and training sessions that would allow them to keep up with numbers management, insight to new ideas in the guard world or even keeping update in technique and educational standards, but is it ethically sound for an instructor to be judging? Especially during championships? Does that make logical sense? Again I point out I am not bashing anything, merely questioning and hoping for understanding on this situation. Aren't there enough judges in the circuit to have them adjudicate groups during championships that are not currently instructing, and if there are not, why not?
JenKozy wrote:Just one question.

Are judges REQIRED to attend "training"?
To answer this question, I believe we have all RSVP'd to meetings, and I do believe they are mandatory in order for you to get the "OK" from the committee and the judge coordinator, who I believe is Bob Moorefield.
That depends on your definition of "Logic".

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by mredom » Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:59 am

Well, my 2 cents is this. There are tremendous challenges facing NCBA. I have tried to work within the system to make the situation a fair one for my students, and after 5 years I can say that I'm done.

I don't expect to win, I don't expect to lose. I encourage my students to challenge themselves and work to improve as performers and artists. I am NOT hung up on numbers, nor do I care about placement. I do however think I owe it to look at our divisions and carefully put my students in the division which describes them. (those descriptions already disclosed within an earlier post.)

After our first NCBA competition in February, I was informed that we were so good, we would need to move to open class. We had a strong show, but were VERY inexperienced, and I was very specific about the reasons why we should be in scholastic vs. open. With less then a week's notice before Armijo and Fairfield, we were told (with no opportunity for appeal) we would be moved to open.

Our first competition we scored an 83, at Fairfield and Armijo a 79 (then moved back to scholastic). At McClatchy we scored a 76.

At champs, my guard (which was so good we needed to be bumped in Feb.) placed dead last in every caption by every judge at champs.

Do I think we were the best guard in Scholastic? no, I don't. We didn't have the kind of performance at champs that we would have liked. Were we the worst, in every caption across the board? No. We weren't. But I did get the message. Unfortunately it was at the expense of several very dedicated and hard working young people, and a very devoted and talented staff. I will not sacrifice their efforts on the altar of NCBA.

What this insurered was that this would be our last competition in the NCBA circuit. I wish you all luck in your desire to improve and modernize the circuit, but I no longer have the patience, and my students deserve better.
"Here's the thing..."

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by Psalm 56 » Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:04 pm

:cry: :cry: :cry:

Seriously...no sarcasm...sad.

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by guardthepiccolo » Mon Apr 09, 2012 5:33 pm

I would just like to acknowledge that there has definitely been a change for the better in NCBA. After a few years away, I came back with my 2nd guard this season, and found that for the most part, our scores were fairly consistent throughout the season, and comments, particularly in the movement caption, had improved greatly. I think this year was definitely a step in the right direction, so thank you to the judges committee for putting in your effort to make the circuit-not-so-circuit a more consistent, more educational place to provide competition for our kids :yeah:
Are there improvements to make? Yes, but I think that this conversation is lacking acknowledgement of progress. Though gradual, at least it's happening! (Of course, I'm still a proponent to switching over to WGI sheets, to allow guards to further their programs to a national level, but that's another can of worms =P)
So thank you for your commitment to excellence!
Benicia High School C/O '05
Colorguard Instructor

Psalm 56
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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by Psalm 56 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:28 am

Perception is reality...or is it... Reality is perception. One's perception of progress is one's reality. In the end all any one person wants is empathy. For those folks in the PERCUSSION world - there was some inconsistent scoring that needs to be looked at and I believe those folks need an empathetic ear; oppose to "tough."

Maybe the guard world is getting it together.

Yet, to the folks (guardthepiccolo) who believe that the guard world is getting its act together, I look forward to hearing what you believe needs improvement. I would again make the suggestion of an evaluation show. I would like to see a regional championship show and a more realistic number of units at a championship show ($$$$ for that day is becoming an issue). I would like to see the nonsense of "your guard is good enough to be bumped up" ooooops .. the following week "sorry it's not" OOOPs...the following week "that guard that was good enough to be bumped up now bumped down and now comes in LAST PLACE at Champs" NONSENSE stop....EVAL SHOW MAY may HELP WITH THAT NONSENSE.

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by Psalm 56 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:28 am

Perception is reality...or is it... Reality is perception. One's perception of progress is one's reality. In the end all any one person wants is empathy. For those folks in the PERCUSSION world - there was some inconsistent scoring that needs to be looked at and I believe those folks need an empathetic ear; oppose to "tough."

Maybe the guard world is getting it together.

Yet, to the folks (guardthepiccolo - by the way doing some amazing work) who believe that the guard world is getting its act together, I look forward to hearing what you believe needs improvement. I would again make the suggestion of an evaluation show. I would like to see a regional championship show and a more realistic number of units at a championship show ($$$$ for that day is becoming an issue). I would like to see the nonsense of "your guard is good enough to be bumped up" ooooops .. the following week "sorry it's not" OOOPs...the following week "that guard that was good enough to be bumped up now bumped down and now comes in LAST PLACE at Champs" NONSENSE stop....EVAL SHOW MAY may HELP WITH THAT NONSENSE.

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Re: NCBA Championships Recaps and Comments

Post by danceswithwood » Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:23 am

Zero wrote: I'd love to see JoJo Dangerfield back and sharing her knowledge.
Thank you, I appreciate that!

Jojo

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